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RELIGION AND RULE 

by Idris Ahmed Osman
Sunday, July 06, 2008

 

57:27 Then, in their wake, We followed them up with (others of) Our apostles: We sent after them Jesus the son of Mary, and bestowed on him the Gospel; and We ordained in the hearts of those who followed him Compassion and Mercy. But the Monasticism which they invented for themselves, We did not prescribe for them: (We commanded) only the seeking for the Good Pleasure of Allah. But that they did not foster as they should have done. Yet We bestowed, on those among them who believed, their (due) reward, but many of them are rebellious transgressors.

5:44 It was We who revealed the law (to Moses): therein was guidance and light. By its standard have been judged the Jews, by the prophets who bowed (as in Islam) to Allah's will, by the rabbis and the doctors of law: for to them was entrusted the protection of Allah's book, and they were witnesses thereto: therefore fear not men, but fear me, and sell not my signs for a miserable price. If any do fail to judge by (the light of) what Allah hath revealed, they are (no better than) Unbelievers.

15:9 We have, without doubt, sent down the Message; and We will assuredly guard it (from corruption).

 

Br. Dhool’s article: Is separation of religion and state important?, is a good start and lead to reinstate and emphasise my previous article: Silencing the secularists.

The hadith which Dhool quoted below, as good and famous, (HASAN, MASHHUR) has certain serious defects which may be hidden from the innocent brother: Quote:

In the Hadith HASAN MASHHÛR – the Prophet impressed upon Muslims to seek knowledge no matter how far the distant — even as far as China: "Seeking knowledge is an obligation upon every Muslim." Unquote.

 

Imam al-Shawkani included it in his book: “the collected benefits of the fabricated hadiths”. Ibn Haban said: This hadith is severely weak and baseless. In its chain of narration there is a man called Ateka who reports extremely weak ahadith. While the wording of the hadith is famous, nevertheless all the chains of its narration are very weak such that Ibn Al Jawzi included it in his list of fabricated hadiths.

 

There is conspicuously every historic reason as to why we are short-sighted with respect to the ideal application of the Islamic Shariah, religion and rule or Islamic state. Careful reading of the above verses from the noble Quran discerns the truth from the falsehood and removes all doubts. The Church indulged in a superstition and monasticism, the Jews and Christians were assigned the duty to protect Allah’s book, judge by it, keep it unaltered and intact. Through the course of time, they changed and distorted it, of course then the people rebelled against religion and sought refuge elsewhere. This shall never happen in Islam because Allah says: (We will assuredly guard it from corruption). It is not angels who would do the job; it is men like you and me, ordinary men (In contrary to the Rabbis, Bishops and Pastors who claimed inspiration to revise the word of Allah) but so much different to us, blessed with piety, deep understanding and knowledge of the religion. It should be noted that while the word “The Message” –“Al-Dhikra” refers to the Quran, Allah protected even the tradition of the prophet sallalahu alaihi wasallam. So many scholars of hadith like Imam Al Bukahri, Imam Muslim, At-tirmadhi, Annasai, Ibnu Majah, Al Beihaqi, Abu Daud, Imam Ahmad,  Imam Abdullah Ibnal Mubarak Imam al-Shawkani, Al-Saghani, Ibn Al Jawzi, Imam Sufyan Al-Thawri, in the past to current day, Sh. A/Qadir Al-Arnaudh, Sh. Muhammad Shakir, Sh. Muhsen Al-Abbad, Sh. Al-AlBani etc, sorted the hadith and classified it into Sahih (authentic or sound), Hasan (good), Dha’ef (weak), Maudhu or Badhil (Fabricated or forged), Munkar (denounced), Mudraj (interpolated), Mauquf (stopped), Muttasel (continuous), Munqadhe’ (broken), Marfu’ (elevated), Maqdhu’ (severed), Ghareb

(Scarce or strange), Mursal (hurried), Mutawater (consecutive), Mash-hur (famous), Musalsal (uniformly-linked), Mu’alal (defective), Maqlub (overturned), Muddhareb (shaky), and Shadh (irregular).

Apart from the central infallible noble figure Prophet Muhammad sallalahu alaihi wasallam, 53:3-4 Nor does he say (aught) of (his own) Desire. It is no less than inspiration sent down to him; there is none else who is entitled to have unlimited, unreserved, total obedience to his statements. Imam Malik is quoted saying in this context: Everyone’s statements maybe accepted and rejected except the dweller of this graveyard, pointing to the sepulchre of the prophet salallahu alaihi wasallam. The four Imams of the four schools of thought used to issue disclaimer saying: If my statement, opinion, (say interpretation, for the sake of Br. Dhool), contradicts that of the prophet salallhu alaihi wasallam then cast mine against the wall, meaning ignore me. In Islam, there is no such central figure as a Rabbi or a Bishop who monopolises the religion, sitting on his pulpit in the Church or the Synagogue, to whom followers resort as a medium through which to have access to God. In Islam, even the leaders of the believers had been challenged and reckoned by the public. It is really inconvenient and shame to say religion and politics are lethal mix. If by any means Man should be the interpreter of religious teachings according to the relevant conditions and status, whereby few men may temporarily misinterpret , err or fail to achieve the idealistic nature of its application; should we, Allah forbid, desert all religion and follow foot steps of the Church?!. Is that what leads to progress and Development?!. Dhool said in his article, quote: In the 16th century, the churches used to rule in Europe. It is now many centuries since religion and politics have been separated in the West. We must ask, why? The reason is because religion and politics are lethal mix. Again we must ask, why? The problem is not religion. The problem is man. Unquote.

 

Emotional aspect against sound reasoning of our mentality and mindset already jumped to the conclusion that Dhool is advocating for the separation of religion from state or holds the opinion that religion and state are incompatible. It is extremely dangerous as it is sounds like the secularists’ blasphemous stigma in their parroting the enemies of Islam. I am sure this is not the case with brother Dhool. However Dhool’s vague message, if misunderstood, might precipitate so many harsh criticisms, if not a religious edict (Fatwa) against him. Where blindfold emotions supersede the faculty of reasoning or allegorical deduction (Qiyas), anyone who tries to have his say, but in a wrong way, might be accused of being an antagonist who is antipathetic against Islam. Quite simply, I do lay the blame on Br. Dhool and the likes who have not acquired a thorough concept of what the overall application of religious tenets and principles into all walks of life means, yet try to speak about the separation of religion from state. Before he despatches his next piece let me offer him, in the following lines, some points to ponder in order for him to rectify the misunderstanding.

 

Basically our imagination can not extend beyond what we never experienced but only read in history. Generally, the whole Muslim world has been suffering since the decline of the Ottoman Empire in an epoch of colonialism followed by dictatorships. It is nearly a century since the tide of the Ottoman Empire ebbed in the territories under its rule. Regarding our part of the world, Somalia has constantly been kept under darkness of colonialism, communism, and now bloody civil wars. I am quite sure that Dhool like many other intellectuals, with whom I had an encounter, are being braced with an illusion in terms of religion and rule, the imagination of irrevocable religious interpretation by clerics where there would be no room for any further discussion, debate and discourse, etc. I am very sorry to say but this misleading concept emanates from their abated grasp of the collectiveness of the religious injunction and divine law (Shariah). This religion” Islam” is a constitution; a judiciary system, a complete way of life which penetrates into the individual and society’s aspects, family structure, economics, business transaction, international relations and politics, peace and war, the military and the defence system, the education system and the media, the public services, the social relations, etc. The prophet salallahu alaihi wasallam is being described by friends and foes alike, as the greatest leader of all time. He would saunter in the bazaars, dig his hand deep into the heap of barley for sale, feel wet and ask the merchandiser: Why did you conceal the wet part underneath?, the seller would say, O’ messenger of Allah, it rained on it. He would say: He who cheats is not of us (Muslims). He used to sketch a strategic plan of military defence, lead the army, forge international and national relations and sign treaties with monarchs and chiefs of the tribes in Arabia. One of the beauties of Islam is that it lays general guidelines under whose framework there is abundant freedom to act accordingly. There are limitations on extreme ends as lawful (halal) and unlawful (haram), where the end points terminate seem to be very slightly touching or intermingling hence doubtful matters (shubuhaat) arise.  In a sahih hadith narrated by At-tirmidhi, Ibn Majah, Al Baihaqi, the flexibility to set conditions and parameters for the benefit of mankind is clearly indicated as: Muslims are accountable to the binding conditions they set for themselves except a condition which contradicts the divine law by making lawful what is unlawful and vice versa. For instance, as a Muslim, one is accountable to abide by the man made law of traffic system. Stopping strictly at red and moving on green. There are many issues today where Mankind is compelled to seek ethical guidance (Religion), such as clinical phases of drug trials and testing on animals, human cloning, organ donation and transplant, abortion, etc. In economics and business, Islamic banking, interest-free loan, mortgage, savings, interest free trading system, Shariah-compliant business transaction is becoming a booming subject in the modern world.

 

Once we agree unanimously that excellent governance can only be achieved by the ideal application of the Islamic Shariah, in other words religion involved in regulating the state. We can now move to the clerics who might interpret the law with respect to the prevalent issues such as politics. Sadly, Br. Dhool says, quote: it is hard to criticize clerics who use religion to rule.  They will not tolerate dissent as they are likely to believe their verdicts are divinely inspired. Unquote.  Umar Ibnul Khattab whose longer duration of rule is characterised as the most remarkable and par excellence governance had been questioned by one of the audience regarding the extra length of his garment. Umar amazed the questioner that he did not have financial means so he borrowed part of it from his son. (For your information, he was ruling the most civilised nations on earth). He could easily turn to the social fund, the welfare trust, the national bank, his personal account in Swiss banks and order ships load of the latest fashion suits. Besides it was Ameerul Mu’meneen Umar who used to carry the sacks of grain and barley on his back, in the darkness of the night, to deliver it to the elderly and the widows with orphans. Had only Br. Dhool known that the leader of the believers Umar Ibn Al-Khattab during his sermon on the pulpit was criticised and refuted by a woman among the audience.  

Furthermore, to relieve Br. Dhool and many other’s anxiety, the complete application of religion in all affairs of the state does not mean that the politician, the pilot, the surgeon, the medical or veterinary doctor, the farmer and the fisherman would be dictated how to do their job by clerics who may not have experience in it. The prophet salallahu alaihi wasallam said: You know better your worldly matters. In Sahih Muslim. It was an occasion when he told date farmers to employ whatever method (traditional cross fertilization) they could use. In the battle of the trench (Khandaq), the prophet salallhu alaihi wasallam approved and supported the opinion of Salman AlFarsi who had an experience to the Persian war strategy to dig the trench around the inlets to Medina. Br. Dhool’s words resonate from a source of utter agitation with personalities whose dual character and mischief abuse the ideal application of the noble Quran. Values come from one’s environment and upbringing. Values (qiyam) are cherished things such as land, flag, nation etc. If one’s parent(s) were clannish, one is likely to be clannish. Anyone can learn the entire Holy book by heart. One’s fairness (fair-mindedness) and judiciousness does not come by the mere reading of the holy book — they stem from other factors.

Dhool should appreciate that the other factors through which they could acquire a positive concept, without it being a logic excuse, has been barred and blocked by years of colonialism, communism, conflicts and chaos. Yet, Islam teaches the basics of love of the country or locality (patriotism), the prophet salallahu alaihi wasallam would say, pointing to mount Uhud: This is a mountain which loves us and we love it. He was so attached to Mecca that at his last ditch of bidding it farewell, he said: Had your people not evicted me by force, I would never have left you. The pilgrim is given intuitive lessons to interact with the nature such as not to uproot or cut any tree, plant, neither harm nor kill an animal for game. In fact it is the religion which teaches the minute details of discipline and etiquette in life. Unfortunately it is being negligently ignored as trivial matters. Neighbourhood, for example, is one of the most important rights which Islam emphasises till the prophet salallahu alaihi wasallam said: Jibril kept on advising me about the rights of the neighbours so much that I started thinking, they will be given a share in inheritance. Bukahri and Muslim.

 

These are the real values ( Qiyam ) of the land and people. Yet about the national anthem, the flag, and other national emblems and anniversaries, the matter of the fact is that principally and ideally the whole Muslim world should be one Ummah under one banner and ruled by one leader of the believers (Ameerul Mu’meneen). The current synthetic geographical borders between the Muslim nations, which most of us think natural due to lack of historical knowledge, is the handiwork of the colonists. Britain and France as two major colonists of the Muslim world have had pivotal influence on the demarcation of the territories under its mandate in the so called protectorates. The psychological negative impact of the colonial and other system’s ideologies have had on our lives is clearly manifested in our debased coveting of other’s way of life. Histories of revolutionary godless communist figures such as Lenin, Marx and Engels or events of World Wars had been attached more importance and taught in our schools. While ignoring our far and near past history, the autobiography of the prophet salallahu alaihi wasallam, his struggle to implement the nucleus of the Islamic state in Medina, the heroic history of the rightly guided caliphs both in peace and war as well as our blessed and gallant freedom fighters, martyrs who expelled the Italian and British colonists from our land on these days in history. Our problem lies in our comparison of the bad, the worse and the worst where we have never experienced the best. Of course, in view of the worst, the bad would be seen as the good. In other words, while among patients gloating headache is better than cancer is understandable, it may appear contemptuous to the completely healthy person. In a nutshell, we are still freely roaming around in a vast and spacious prison in which we can not perceive our hindered limitations and the real freedom beyond the fences and barriers. Br. Dhool continues and says, quote:

The question is: will the use of religion bring a good government for Somalia? It is true, according to the Holy Qur’an we are required to rule ourselves by the word of the Almighty. Unfortunately, many Muslims confuse Sharia (the judiciary) with public administration (political matters). Unquote. For the importance thereof, the consequence of failing to rule and judge by what Allah revealed (Al-hukmu bema Anzala Allah) has been reiterated as a rebellious, blasphemer and wrong doer thrice in the same chapter of the Quran:

5:47 Let the people of the Gospel judge by what Allah hath revealed therein. If any do fail to judge by (the light of) what Allah hath revealed, they are (no better than) those who rebel.

5:44 It was We who revealed the law (to Moses): therein was guidance and light. By its standard have been judged the Jews, by the prophets who bowed (as in Islam) to Allah's will, by the rabbis and the doctors of law: for to them was entrusted the protection of Allah's book, and they were witnesses thereto: therefore fear not men, but fear me, and sell not my signs for a miserable price. If any do fail to judge by (the light of) what Allah hath revealed, they are (no better than) Unbelievers.

5:45 We ordained therein for them: "Life for life, eye for eye, nose or nose, ear for ear, tooth for tooth, and wounds equal for equal." But if any one remits the retaliation by way of charity, it is an act of atonement for himself. And if any fail to judge by (the light of) what Allah hath revealed, they are (No better than) wrong-doers.

Unfortunately, Dhool’s and many other’s frustration arises from the very fact that there might be a group of clerics who may not have an insight and deep  experience into international relations and politics, yet because they have raised a religious banner amalgamated with their own interpretation; criticising or opposing them could be very difficult. Worse enough, if some or one of the elite clerics were pursuing a different agenda or personal interest whereby the religious pattern and slogan were employed as a sacred immunity. In Dhool’s case, it would better if he simply focused to exert an emphasis on the importance of strictly applying or judging by the light of what Allah revealed, to oneself first and foremost, to be entitled to handle the noble cause. The ideal application, judging by (the light of) what Allah revealed shall insha Allah one day be implemented, it is the solution to all the problems of Mankind, In modern history all over the Muslim world, men stood up for this noble cause but were met with severe blows from the enemies of Islam. It will definitely be men with unique spirit, inspired by the noble prophet salallahu alaihi wasallam’s tradition, as humble in accepting criticisms and refutations and as strong in establishing justice, as Umar, who will face the challenges on the way to realising this great dream of ours.


Idris Ahmed Osman
E-mail: idahos@hotmail.com



       
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thanks.
 
23 comment(s)
wiifgarow @ 7/10/2008 5:29 PM EST
 brother that comes very close to saying "my hadeeths are better than yours". To which I say no mine are stronger. I believe that Seek Knowledge even from China is one of the most inspirational hadeeths. So sorry I believe it is a strong Hadeeth. We just have to agree to disagree. Deal?
mujaahidulaah @ 7/10/2008 9:37 AM EST
 Asalaamu Calaykum to my brothers and sister of Islam.  All praise is soley due to Allah S.W. and may peace and blessings be upon our beloved Prophet Muhammad S.A.W.  Ammaa Bacda:  Thank you much brother Idris for this well written article about Islam and the current state of Somalia. I agree with you that Islam should govern every aspect of our daily lives.  The Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: "God, His angels and all those in Heavens and on Earth, even ants in their hills and fish in the water, call down blessings on those who instruct others in beneficial knowledge." - Al-Tirmidhi, Hadith 422
Those who have knowledge should be convayers of islam, meaning they should convey that knowledge to everyone no matter race, color, or ethnicity.  Also, I agree that the Muslims have been seperated by borders, money, current politics, patritisim for ones "country" and many, many more.  (Al-Ahnaf said:) I went out carrying my arms during the nights of the affliction (i.e. the war between 'Ali and 'Aisha) and Abu Bakra met me and asked, "Where are you going?" I replied, "I intend to help the cousin of Allah's Apostle (i.e.,'Ali)." Abu Bakra said, "Allah's Apostle said, 'If two Muslims take out their swords to fight each other, then both of them will be from amongst the people of the Hell-Fire.' It was said to the Prophet, 'It is alright for the killer but what about the killed one?' He replied, 'The killed one had the intention to kill his opponent.'" (Sahiih Al-Bukhari Hadith No. 30, Vol. 1). I would like to say to "shabeel" that his or her statement "But isn't Shariah itself a man-made compilation of various sources written hundreds years after the passing prophet Muhammed (pbuh)?" that the Shariah derives from firstly the Quran and secondly the sunnah of our Prophet S.A.W.  So for you to dought that " Sentencing someone to death by stoning is kind primitive and not gonna work now." is comlpetely going against the teachings of the Prophet S.A.W.  Sentencing someone to death by stoning deters one from committing that certain crime that deserves that particular punishment.  I believe that if this law was implemented in very muslim and non-muslim country we would not have STD's, teens getting pregnent before marriage, illegitement children, fornication and many problems that result in the determent of the family.
danabka garxa @ 7/10/2008 7:01 AM EST
 ahmed kamil, let me refresh your memories my brother(maybe
you didn`t get the bigger picture)THE ISSUE IS WHAT ISLAM
WAS, IS AND WILL ALWAYS BE! IT IS A WAY OF LIFE, A WAY OF THINKING,
A MODEL FOR ALL MANKIND my friend choosing and giving to us by
Almighty ALLAH! so the question is are prepare to accept
GOD WORD as the true paths and our only way to save our
life from corruptions and sins and save our soul from hell
or are we gona waste our time by talking nonsenses all the time
Waxaa meesha yaala dadka leh waxaan ka doodaynaa
habsamaanta alla diintiisa u dhigay waxay haboon in la eego
sida ay ula dhaqmaan xaaskooda (oona marwalba hadaynu soomali nahay
ruuxa hadal naxariis leh ama mar walba oo loo yimaad la weydiiyo sida ay tahay nafteedu)
iyo caruurtooda ayna 90% wax war ah ka hayn.
Sidee bay dadka nuuca ahi u heli karaan wax umada dhan raali
galiya oo cadaalad, sinaan, quudhsi la`aan ay ugu fakaraan marka ay
kuwii xaqa ku lahaa ayna wali 100% xilkoodii ka soo bixin?

in ay si
Gaadh'haye @ 7/9/2008 11:35 AM EST
 "...if my opinion would count, I am of the view that it should be opened..", that is what I wrote down there, Layla.
ahmed kamil @ 7/9/2008 4:01 AM EST
 The issue is not what ISLAM was, we can appreciate Islamic history and what was achieved but the reality is we are in modern time and we must deal with the social realities of our day. And unfortunately, today the clerics are not representative of the idea's of Islam. And Islam is a constitution and Law and Order. But the problem is that there is no example of that. There needs to be great debate and deep discussion on the application of Islamic law. The idea needs to be separated from practicability in addressing the realities of our time.    

Furthermore, the etiquettes of disagreement on idea's and concepts is to make your point without showing the presumed errors of the other. There is no need to demonstrate that the 'other' was wrong but you simply need to show and highlight your perspective intelligently and with candor.    
laylasamatar @ 7/8/2008 7:11 PM EST
 gaadhka - and whats your point are you pro or against or confused????
somalidaye @ 7/8/2008 10:18 AM EST
 Hol I on't see any reason for complaint in this topic.
It is a religious article and people need to be
warned for challenging ALLAAH'S words. In doing so,
one needs to warn them just as it is in the KORAN.
One can't shoot off their mouth about ISLAM and expect
feelings not to get hurt. We aren't kuffars and we
shouldn't be that sensitive about criticism.
I ysed to hear that " shy and arrogant people will
never learn"
baghdad bob @ 7/8/2008 3:28 AM EST
 sucaad usa

you made me laugh, perhaps you just wanted to complain for the sake of complaining or could it be this is a misdirected anger? is your husband involved in aggravting you in anayway? lol
Sucaad_USA @ 7/8/2008 1:35 AM EST
 To: HOL, this is a somali website that millions of somalies arround the world come and read your articles and exchange their comments. However reasonly this place it seems us ch'unky place and some people are o'ffended including me. My point is for those of you who are adminstraters the system needs to be upgraded and set some rules what to post and what not to post and to look people who are h;arrasing&d'iscriminating and in'sulting other people based of their own agenda. If this is what you want to be your Website than millions of people will leave and eventually will turn down and find better places to express their thoughts with dignity and respect. i would suggest you do it something as soon as possible. It is your interest and as a readers we pay attention to our blogs
Mahmud @ 7/7/2008 12:54 PM EST
 Shabeel
About Sharee'ah
Who Should implement it? The judiciary and the courts represented by a judge (Qadi)
How? According to the Quran and Sunnah
When? At all times
What conditions? The conditions are mentioned in the Quran and Sunnah
Under what authority? Under the authority of Allah subhanahu wata'aalaa.

The actions of some individuals or governments such as the Taliban or Saudi Arabia should not be used as an example of how islamic law is evil and un-implmentable. If you're going to judge Islam, use its sources...i.e. The Quran and Sunnah
Gaadh'haye @ 7/7/2008 12:41 PM EST
 “…And what about Ijtihad? Isn’t it time to revisit and re-open its "doors" to address modern issues?” Shabeel.

There are different Islamic schools of thought who  differ on the issue of “Ijtihad”, its application and  whether its ‘doors’ should be open or remain ‘closed’ for ever.

I am not at liberty to delve into issues of Islamic jurisprudence which I am not deeply versed in.
However, if my opinion would count, I am of the view that it should be opened, especially now that we are in this technologically advanced stage in humanity.
This is not to suggest that Islam is backward and pre-modern religion, but rather to exercise ‘flexibility’ and adjust to the demands of our times, where our religion permits.

Contemporary Islamic Uluma had given variety of opinions regarding the issue of the application of Ijtihad, some in favour of it while others are against.

Those Islamic scholars who ruled in its favour argue –and they may be correct for that matter- that “Ijtihad is really important to offer solutions and to provide the perspective of Shari`ah in any new issue. Since Muslim jurists agree that "the more people live, the more they get new issues and new rulings for these issues." They also caution and direly warn that there should be "No ijtihad in the existence of a legal text" i.e. what the holly Quran had decreed, and that which is regulated in the authentic Ahaadiis.  They are of the view that since Ijtihad “is an exercise of one's reasoning to arrive at a logical conclusion on a legal issue done by jurists to deduce a conclusion as to the effectiveness of a legal percept in Islam," its methods should not include ‘reinterpretation’ of legal texts such as the holly Quran and authentic Ahaadiis to suit the particular issue the Mujtahid wants to handle.

There are those who argue for the permanent closure of the ‘doors’ of Ijtihaad. They offer quite convincing arguments and cite Quranic verses and Ahaadiis for that matter. Due to space constraints, and not being deeply versed on this issue, I cannot delve into the tenets of the latter argument.

If I am wrong in this opinion, it’s solely on my self and Shaytaan.

anti-dabodhilif @ 7/7/2008 11:17 AM EST
  We obey Allah and his messenger S. A. W.  Allah told us to folow his diin completly. We shouldnot question Allah's words and say his words canot be implement coz itis "2008". The pagan clander. We  shouldnot pick and choose Allah's words. Take them all like real muslims or leave them all like kuffars did. Simple as that. I will not reject Allah's words to please kuffars, and I am not worrying about what they will say to me when I am following Allah's words.
shabeel @ 7/7/2008 10:33 AM EST
 Again, this is so simple. who, how and when it should be implemented?  what conditions, what environment and what authority should implement it.
Runta Sheeg @ 7/7/2008 8:01 AM EST
 Wadaad ku sheega sida aweys daahir, xasan turki, shariifka,
mukhtaar rooboow, iyo kuwo kale oo faro badan, dhamaantood
waa kooxo gacansaar la leh CIA, sida Cusaama bin laden
ayey hoosta CIA kala xiran yihiin waana dad loogu talogalay
in ay halaagaan dadka muslimiinta ah si ay ugu khaldaan
qiiro ebera.
baghdad bob @ 7/7/2008 2:51 AM EST
 baghdad bob
|
V
@ 7/7/2008 2:18 AM EST
 shabeel

I have no time for sarcasim, but its quite intersting to see your utter ignorance in Islamic law. I don't blame you honestly, its very much complicated especially in relation to Islmaic banking which is growing at an alarming rate and soon be a 2 trillion dollar financial deal and again I don't expect you to understand much of it but reading some topics on the corned subjets will surely do you good, just for a starter.
You gave me some pathetic examples while at the same time contridicting yourself by dragging in some dubious names such as Ali mahdi etc. I hope you are intelligent enough to see the contridiction I am reffering to; if not our discussion is futile. Islamic law covers a wide spectrum from inheritence, marriage, tax, banking, public order, war conduct, human rights, social issues, religious matters etc and volumes upon volumes of books was written on each and every sub-topic of the few main topics I just mentioned.
You seem to be reffering to history by mentioning year 608, for your information some of the social systems derived from islamic law were newly introduced in many European countries namely social welfare system. It was introduced mostly in the 60s in  western Europe, while the weak and the poor were fed through the Baytul-maal some 1400 years ago. this was possible due to the fact that they had elaborate tax system in place. of course this sort of laws were introduced once the prequisite of for islamic law was fulfilled which was basically teaching and educating the public by men who were well versed in Islam.    
shabeel @ 7/7/2008 12:43 AM EST
 The calendar I am using now and I live now says year is 2008. We are not discussing time here and I am not challenging my creator but charlatans. The things you said are sidetrack and have nothing to do with my questions.
So let us focus on the issue of Shariah and please read what I wrote very careful. If would be great and beneficial if you can enlighten me, convince me that Shariah is viable now in Somalia and address my concern.
@ 7/7/2008 12:21 AM EST
 Excellent article by Idris Ahmed Osman. Keep the good work.
anti-dabodhilif @ 7/7/2008 12:11 AM EST
 shabele  who told you the year is 2008? Do you use pagan clender? It copuld be 2 millions years . Only alah knows.  If you belive Allah and his laws, you shouldnot say not this time. Allah owns this world and you so you dont have right to say this is not the right time like  kuffars say. You are chalenging with your creator and his laws. That is big sin.
shabeel @ 7/6/2008 9:13 PM EST
 Let us just not argue about romantic concepts but practical realism. I am not against Shariah per se but I am worried about its practicality, how it will effect me? who is supposed to implement it? who is qualified to execute it? are they sane and rationale people? Do they have jurisdiction over the whole? under what condition and environment it is supposed to be implemented? does Shariah guarantee equal access to the law? Does it address modern times issues? the year now is 2008 and not 608!
shabeel @ 7/6/2008 9:01 PM EST
 That is what one would call selective reasoning and judgmental cherry-picking. My focus is with the concept of Ijtihad. Let me follow your logic and say that if Shariah is good and implemented, is there a guarantee, is there that its application would be fair to all? that no one is exempted of persecution as is in the case of the Saudi Royal Family? or does it only apply to the weak and poor as was the case in Mogadishu under warlord Ali Mahdi's reign in Northern Mogadishu? Ali Dheere chopped limbs of the needy poor who stole some scarf and cheap jewelery. 15 minutes after, this barbarism. Ironically they found the jewelery. At the time, the biggest thugs and thieves, the warlord sharks were immune of the Shariah discriminating punishment.    
baghdad bob @ 7/6/2008 8:00 PM EST
 shebeel

No its not primitive it befits the crime perfectly like a hand in a glove. If its not curtailed right in its inception it will cause something worse than death; social chaos and break down of families as is the case today all over the world, ultimately it also leads to death. a case in point thousands of men and women die due to infedlity in USA.
What is even more primite is the law that lets people buy themsleves off from their crimes, interestingly enough its about infedility and the husband ending up not only killing the wive but her lover, that was none other than Oj simpson. we all know he killed them both and yet he walked away free like OJ all day! because the system is so primitive it lets criminals walk away and puts to death poor african americans. Over 2 million african americans are sitting in jails because they can't buy "justice", some of them are put to death for the same reasons. several of these were absolved from their crimes thanks to DNA but that did not prevent their death.
shabeel @ 7/6/2008 7:19 PM EST
 Excellent response and good read. But isn't Shariah itself a man-made compilation of various sources written hundreds years after the passing prophet Muhammed (pbuh)? And what about Ijtihad? isn't it time to revisit and re-open its "doors" to address modern issues? Sentencing someone to death by stoning is kind primitive and not gonna work now.

 
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